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To  : APRDIG@WW

TAPR APRS Special Interest Group Digest for Wednesday, June 09, 2004.

1. Re: tapr email server is being blacklisted
2. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
3. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
4. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
5. Car-puter update
6. D-Link DWL-P100 POE adapter
7. Re: Car-puter update
8. RE:  Car-puter update
9. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
10. Re: APRS Hardware
11. Re: APRS Hardware
12. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
13. Re: NEW TOPIC!
14. APRS TT
15. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
16. Re: New National OPENtrack freq (How pathetic)??
17. new antenna design
18. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
19. Re: New National OPENtrack freq (How pathetic)
20. Re: APRS Hardware
21. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
22. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
23. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
24. Re: APRS TT
25. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
26. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
27. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
28. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
29. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
30. Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit Programming.
31. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
32. disabling APO on Kenwood TM-733
33. Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit Programming.
34. Re: APRS TT
35. Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit Programming.
36. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
37. Re: APRS TT
38. D'Oh!
39. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
40. Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit Programming.
41. Re: APRS Hardware
42. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
43. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
44. Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit Programming.
45. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
46. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
47. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
48. Re: APRS user beware part 2
49. Re: Venus transit?
50. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
51. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
52. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
53. Re: APRS TT
54. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
55. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
56. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
57. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
58. Re: APRS TT
59. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
60. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
61. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
62. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
63. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
64. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
65. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
66. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
67. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit
Programming.
68. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
69. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
70. Re: APRS TT
71. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
72. Re: APRS Protocol - A Modest Proposal
73. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
74. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
75. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
76. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
77. RE: APRS user beware part 2
78. Re: APRS user beware part 2
79. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
80. Re: APRS TT
81. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
82. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit
Programming.
83. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
84. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit
Programming.
85. The 6th day, was yada yada yada
86. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
87. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
88. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
89. Re: APRS TT
90. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
91. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
92. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
93. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
94. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
95. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
96. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
97. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
98. Re: APRS user beware part 2
99. Re: disabling APO on Kenwood TM-733
100. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
101. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
102. Re: disabling APO on Kenwood TM-733
103. Re: APRS TT
104. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
105. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
106. I AM OUTTA HERE! (38% is good enough for me!)
107. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit
Programming.
108. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
109. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
110. two questions
111. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
112. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
113. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
114. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
115. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit
Programming.
116. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
117. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit
Programming.
118. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
119. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
120. DTMF Decoding for my talking weather station
121. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
122. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
123. Re: two questions
124. How to Run ZTerm on Mac OS X?
125. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit
Programming.
126. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
127. Re: [ Robert Bruninga ] Re: D700 - Yes mine has FLASH and In-Circuit
Programming.
128. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
129. Re: DTMF Decoding for my talking weather station
130. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
131. Re: I AM OUTTA HERE! (38% is good enough for me!)
132. Re: How to Run ZTerm on Mac OS X?
133. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
134. Re: DTMF Decoding for my talking weather station
135. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
136. Re: How to Run ZTerm on Mac OS X?
137. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
138. Re: How to Run ZTerm on Mac OS X?
139. Belkin - OSX --- OOOPPSSSS!
140. Re: two questions
141. Re: APRS TT
142. Re: Belkin - OSX --- OOOPPSSSS!
143. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
144. Echolink
145. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
146. Re: two questions
147. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
148. Re: DTMF Decoding for my talking weather station
149. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
150. Re: APRS TT
151. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
152.  ZTerm on Mac OS X?
153. Re: ZTerm on Mac OS X?
154. Re[2]: Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
155. RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
156. Re: APRS TT
157. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
158. Re: Tetroon collateral damage report, revision1
159. Re: Kenwood APRS radio...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: tapr email server is being blacklisted
From: Danny <danny@messano.net>
Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 02:55:00 -0400
X-Message-Number: 1

Just now getting 2 dys worth of sig mail thanks to Spamcop.. I noticed the
sig was way quiet here.  Checked my brideheads and found sig mail being
refused.   Seem to have a problem a week with them.. Ho hum.

Danny
KE4RAP

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: Kenwood APRS radio...
From: Danny <danny@messano.net>
Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 03:20:32 -0400
X-Message-Number: 2

KA> Ummm Danny,  I currently use a D700, and I have a fellow HAM a couple
KA> miles down the road from me who ordered his today.  In addition, as soon
KA> as I receive a legal settlement, I intend to purchase to more D-700's
KA> and about 4 D-7A's..all for the same reason as my friend just bought his
KA> and I bought my first one...APRS in a box.  No further equipment needed
KA> to get on it.  I don't know about this Holy Grail stuff.  I do know it's
KA> a darned useful radio!!   I really don't see it as "outdated".

Please read my statement again.. They used the outdated APRS 1.0 protocol
and are LOCKED into it.. That was the point.  

>>We need better than "but.. but.. the kenwoods can't do that!"  Maybe
KA> you get a percentage of the sale of every kenwood?? Hmmm...

KA>      C'mon.....get real.

Real?  Real is the fact that arguments are being clouded by monetary and
emotional interests.  We have seen these same arguments since before the
first kenwood hit the shelves.  I'm sure if I had commercial interest in
APRS that I would see things different too, but I am just user, so what do
I know.

KA> Hmmm... I guess lots of folks would buy a radio to NOT use them,
KA> therefore sales figures are inaccurate???   Please explain just how
KA> absurd that is.

My point is that a boght kenwood is not an 'on-air" kenwood.  You claim you
are going to buy some incredible number of kenwoods.. plan to use EACH and
EVERY ONE simultaneously on the air?  

If we are going to claim sales figures, we need to claim the figures on
registered software too, because *** knows EVERY copy of WinAPRS, UI-View,
etc is on the air and being used right NOW.

KA> Sir, your argument appears most illogical, as if the software is
KA> being used it IS being used.  for quite a while, I played with APRS in
KA> DOS version several years old.  But I still used it (until I could find
KA> the upgrades.  So, if I like a version of  software whose version is 3
KA> or more years old, my opinion doesn't count?   Hmmm.  I guess we throw
KA> out the baby with the bath water too??   :-)

Once again, you miss the point.  Bob's arguments eluded to users unwilling
to upgrade.  In my challenge, I was going to give him "points" for any user
with software over 3 years old, which would help substantiate his claims.
Please see the rest of this thread.

Danny
KE4RAP

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
From: Demetre Valaris <sv1uy@yahoo.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 02:25:02 -0700 (PDT)
X-Message-Number: 3

>Subject: RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
>From: "DG2JW" <dg2jw@privateasylum.com>
>
>Sorry Bob, this is just an objective comment
regarding >your comment and not a personal attack
against you.
>
>I do have a D7, two of them actually and one D700. I
>can give your their serial numbers.
>I can say that I am very interested in experimenting
>with OpenTrac and support in principle what Jeff and
>the guys are doing. The Kenwood's are good if you
>never want to do anything else but aprs as it exists
>now with them. For this reason I regularly use my Ipaq
>or Palm as a front end that allows software to make up
>for the downfalls of the units.

Hi Julian and group,

I have been watching this discussion with interest and I must say that I am
not sure whether I want to play with OPENTRACK or not, but can you please
tell me, how do you exactly use your Kenwood D700 when you drive? Do you
connect it to a PC and watch the PC instead of the road? I have a D700 in
my car and when I first installed I was using a GARMIN GPS with a MAP. I
must tell you that my eyes were distructed so much by looking at the GPS
and the radio so in the end I removed the GARMIN and installed permanently
a blind GPS that looks like a small PC mouse. Now I have the D700 right
infront of me at the dashboard above the speed-o-meter etc and I never take
my eyes off the road. So really when I get in the car all I do is to clip
the D700 frontplate and connect the RJ-7 clip and I am QRV on APRS. I only
look at the screen when I hear a message coming or a packet from the Voice
Alert setup, or anyway very briefly without having to take my eyesight off
the raod. Also with the nice DTMF lighted microphone I can type short SMS
messages very easily. I would not want to use my D700 with a PC connected
to it since it is really dangerous to drive while watching the PC.

Unless of course if you do not use the D700 when mobile but then the D700
is a mobile radio.

>Again I do own them, and I am very happy to tell
>people what I think the shortcomings are. Does that
>mean Ill toss them in the trash? No, but Ill find
>other ways of using them in a way that may not have
>been considered by the design teams of the D7 and
>D700.

Same goes with my D7 (I have 3 of them). I often take my D7 with me
especially when I walk or cycle on the mountain and believe me I do not
need a PC when I use my D7 in this configuration. I like the simplicity of
it when I want to send SMS messages since it is very simple to operate,
nearly as simple as a mobile phone. If I start clotting on with too many
wires and PCs while on the trekk then I will not enjoy anything.

When I am on holiday yes I use my D7 with my PALM and run pocketAPRS with
it ans also APRSdos with my HP200LX and also PACKET RADIO, which I enjoy
very much, but this does not happen as often as I use my D7 when I walk or
when I hike or cycle. I need to operate the D7 without some sort of
computer more often than connecting it to them, because most of the time I
use the D7 I use it as a STANDALONE device.

So really the the D7 as a portable radio is good enough for me, of course
if one wants to use his D7 at home as well then he has to put up with it's
shortcomings because it is not perfect, but I think it is OK for the
purpose it is sold, plus that you can also do PACKET RADIO and connect it
to a PC.

Been able to do APRS with very simple gear is the biggest advantage to me
and I believe to most APRS users. And really if it wasn't for the Kenwood
radios and Bob's persistance we wouldn't have the global APRS network we
have today.

>I dont beleive that my kenwood rigs will become
>obsolete in "ANY WAY". 
>Aprs will continue to exist but there will be
>alternatives in addition to it. Alternatives that
>allow us to push the envelope that much more. 
>It may also be that one day someone will write a
piece >of code that can be incorporated easily into
existing >clients and servers allowing easy
transcoding of APRS >and Opentrac formatted packets
making all of the
>data avalible to to each standard.

Indeed Julian, all the Kenwood radios can be used in PACKET RADIO as well
and this is an advantage.

>I understand that keeping to two communities apart may
>have its advantages, however, from a user point of
>view (which I am),  I can see the benefits of
>transcoding packets rather than ignoring them. Will it
>cause higher bandwidth usage. I dont think so as we
>have a set number of APRS users globally with a small
>percentage being added regulary. Some users will
>continue to use APRS as it is now. SOme will use
>Opentrac exclusively, and others will use both,
>however the number of APRS/Opentrac related users,
>remain at or near the same plus annual growth. There
>is no problem.

I am not sure about that. I think the main problem is the amount of traffic
that will be created by such a system. If the traffic is low and it does
not cause havoc to the existing APRS network, I personally have no problem.
I would like to see it in practice really, i.e. if it does not cause havoc
with my portable/mobile Kenwoods, OK but then again what use is to me
having Kenwood radios to suddenly start hearing packets that are not
decoded by my portable radios? OK when I am at home I use Xastir and from
what I heard Xastir will be able to decode these OPENtrack packets, but is
this the real purpose of APRS? Operating from home? I think it is more
important to operate APRS when portable or mobile!!! If I am not mistaken
this is the main purpose of APRS. Everything else revolves around the
moving stations really because these are the ones that we all want to
track. 

Also what happens with the IGATES? How are they going to pass the OPENtrack
packets on the APRS-IS? I read in this SIG that IGATES as they are now
can't deal with the packets of the new system.

>I am by no means an APRS guru. Im a hacker (and I have
>been called worse) but the bottom line is when either
>side presumes to speak for the users, you might
>consider that the users have been telling the APRS
>world what we want for some time with no results.
>Subjective viewpoints cannot be considered valid in
>regards to respesntation of existing users because
>these same users are telling you something totally
>different than the opinion you put fourth.

Well I am a user too and I think we should try to accomodate the needs of
portable/mobile APRS operators first and then everything else. Because APRS
was made for them in the first place.

>My kenwoods would be more valuble to me if they were
>more flexible with user upgradeble firmware, adding
>the possibility of expanding its usefulness and
>useability in the light of future developments.

Of course they would be. I feel exactly the same way, but why don't we all
pester Kenwood about it?

>Julian
>OH8GEJ

Finally I would like to say that I am all for OPENtrack if it has something
to give to the portable/mobile APRS environmet because if it creates havoc
to an already working APRS network then I don't like it and I believe that
Bob - although some claim that he is not as objective as he should be -
might be right in saying what he says.

If all the software writers followed the APRS specs we would not need
another protocol, we could improve APRS instead.

I must say that these are my personnal views and how I see things and
others are entitled to have different opinions, after all we like to claim
that we live in a democratic world, and of course we should never forget
that we are only doing a HOBBY that we all try to enjoy so flames and
insults should be kept out of the SIG.

========
73 de Demetre SV1UY
e-mail sv1uy@yahoo.com
http://sv1uy.webhop.org
http://www.athnet.ampr.org/~sv1uy
http://www.qsl.net/sv1uy

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
From: "DG2JW" <dg2jw@privateasylum.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 12:50:46 +0300
X-Message-Number: 4

HI Demetre

>>Unless of course if you do not use the D700 when
>>mobile but then the D700 is a mobile radio.

I dont use when Im mobile. I had planned to put it in our subaru in
Finland, but my wife wasnt having it. Now that I spend so much time in
Germany with only a motorbike, I have little use for it until I thought
about using it combined with a computer to monitor and control assets for
search and rescue of which I was apart with my dog in Northern Finland.

However, with smaller HT's and faster PDA's on the market today, unless one
wanted specificalls an out of the box product, I dont see why any one would
pay for such a device anymore. Again would I sell any of my kenwoods? No
because they are very good for APRS, and since APRS will not dissapear
until Thursday, I can still get some use out of them.

One thing though, I do use the screen from my IPAQ while on the motor bike.
Stations are displayed on pocket streets sent to the map as waypoints from
the D7. Since in using the Ipaq for turn by turn routing when touring (to
dangerous in the city) I canj also see stations which are close by in
addition to hotel, camping and petrol station information. Im also normally
zoomed in to about 250- 500 meters because I think its to dangerous trying
to read so much information coming from the display or maps.

The thursday thing was just a joke. :)

Best regards Demetre

Julian

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Car-puter update
From: "Mark Fellhauer" <sparkfel@qwest.net>
Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2004 03:56:13 -0700
X-Message-Number: 5

Well I mentioned that I had plans on building a small car-puter for APRS 
and other uses and that I would keep the group updated...

Here's where it stands right now.

The Via EPIA MII10000 Motherboard and Morex/Casetronic 2699 case I ordered 
from Essential Computing arrived over the weekend.  The motherboard, out of 
the box, was DOA.  It powers up but doesn't POST and has no video.  I tried 
several sticks of different DDR 2100 RAM with no luck.  Cleared CMOS by 
jumper. checked all jumpers, etc...  I tried a known working 350 watt power 
supply over the 2699's dinky 55 watter.  The 2699's power supply does test 
good.

I even took it in to work and had a second pair of eyes look it over, just 
in case I forgot something in the 17 or so years I've been assembling 
computers.  :)  It was agreed by all the system is dead, dead, dead.   It's 
been over 24 hours since I requested an RMA number from Essential Computers 
without a response from them.  Ugh.

I will say the Mini-ITX system drew a crowd of admirers while on the test 
bench.   Is that REALLY a computer?

This afternoon the Matrix Orbital VFD (Vacuum Fluorescent Display), model 
MX322, I ordered as part of this project, showed up at my doorstep.  It 
too, is Dead on Arrival.  Dead, dead, dead.  Again tested on different 
computers.  This unit is supposed to display a splash screen on being 
plugged in - it doesn't.  The USB drivers and USB to serial emulator 
install just fine.  LCDC (the control program) can not find the display, 
and manually setting it up doesn't work either.   An RMA has been requested 
from Matrix Orbital.  I'm very disappointed that a $160 custom device would 
arrive DOA.  It appears that this may even be a returned unit.   Shame, 
shame, Matrix Orbital.

As a funny aside, I recently bought an ultrasonic cleaning device for my 
brother and his wife's wedding anniversary, presented it to them on Monday, 
and it was also DOA. Ahem.

Do companies do QA/QC anymore?

The "Lilliput" 7-inch touch-screen VGA display is on its way.  Any bets on 
if it works when I get it?

This project is not off to an auspicious start

Mark
KC7BXS.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: D-Link DWL-P100 POE adapter
From: "Mark Fellhauer" <sparkfel@qwest.net>
Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2004 04:48:33 -0700
X-Message-Number: 6

I also recently got my mitts on a D-Link DWL-P100 POE (Power over Ethernet)
Adapter.  And I can say I'm fairly impressed.  This is a "professional" 
unit that outputs 48 VDC on the input end and then has a small "regulator" 
on the output end that takes the 48 VDC minus line losses and gives you a 
regulated 5 VDC at 2.5 amps.  This is good enough to power most 802.11x 
access points I've seen, and would probably even power other devices like 
SIP phones.  Power is injected over pins 4, 5 (+) & 7, 8 (-) as tested by 
my trusty Ideal banjo.

D-Link claims it will work a full 100 meters and I have no reason to doubt 
it.  It seems to work well with my old Linksys WAP11.

This is a great way to get power to that remote ethernet device.  I've even 
seen some million dollar homes around here that have structured wiring, and 
the "home run" closet doesn't even have a single electrical 
outlet.  (!)   I guess this shows that contractors really have not picked 
up on the concept completely...  This device might be helpful in a 
situation like this.

I know, I could roll my own, but the cheapest (locally available) 
"universal" switching power supply capable of putting out the amps an 
access point requires is $35 alone.  I got this POE for 42 bucks.  The 
extra 7 dollars for a complete system is well worth it, IMHO.

[commercial content deleted]

73,

Mark
KC7BXS

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: Car-puter update
From: Gerry Creager N5JXS <gerry.creager@tamu.edu>
Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2004 07:20:23 -0500
X-Message-Number: 7

My experience with the EPIA MoBo's has been good so far... about all I 
can offer here.

I have had an astounding number of memory failures, however, in a 
variety of hardware.

Go figure.

gerry n5jxs

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: RE:  Car-puter update
From: WB4GQK@aol.com
Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 08:25:24 EDT
X-Message-Number: 8

Hi Mark& ALL

I purchased a VIA EPIA Mini-ITX with fan less 533 CPU last October, along
with a Casetronics case. I purchased this system to replace a laptop that I
use on my sailboat. The principle problem I was having was with the USB
multiple port adapter. I needed five (5) serial ports, two of which had to
be DB9 serials. As you know the Mini-ITX will handle a plug-in card so I
installed a 2 serial port Card. I also installed 1MB RAM. I installed a
Samsung CDRW/DVD model 308B (very pleased with it's operation). There is NO
3 =BD floppy drive. Since the ITX has 1 DB9 serial port I ended up with 3.

Fortunately nothing happens very fast on a sailboat so the fan-less CPU
handles the 5 application programs that are running simultaneously. Yep
that's 5 and they run 24hrs a day when under way.

        1 Main navigation program The CAP'N
        2 HF  WinAPRS
        3 Marine VHF DSC coding
        4 Icom PCR1000 digital receiver control
        5 WeatherFax 2000

The port requirements are:

        1. DB9 serial to the hydraulic autopilot
        2. DB9 serial to KAM+
        3. USB to Garmin GPS
        4. DB9 serial to PCR 1000 control
        5. USB to PCR 1000 output signal

It all went together very easy. It required almost a month to get all
programs installed and programed including dispersing the GPS data to the
CAP'N, WinAPRS, and DSC.  I permanently installed the ITX in the boat last
December. In February we took a cruise from Tampa Bay to Dry Tortugas.
Every thing worked beautifully. While anchored overnight at the Fort we
stuck a movie DVD in the ITX and really enjoyed the evening.

As with every piece of hardware you use you will find good and bad. I just
happened to have a very good experience with my EPIA Mini-ITX

73 Jim

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: RE: Thoughts on a proposed replacement for D700
From: "KC2MMi" <kc2mmi@verizon.net>
Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 08:57:35 -0400
X-Message-Number: 9

(When a car is moving at even 30 MPH it covers that 60 feet in about 2
seconds.  Demanding one foot resolution on the front panel of a radio is
just stupid)...

Bob, yesterday I was on the highway and got a glimpse of a beautiful
terriby bright red MGB. At least, I think it was an MGB. It was being
approached by a tow truck, and it had been tucked in between some trees off
the edge of the road shoulder incredibly without damage--but at the end of
skid marks.

Must have done a 360 at least to stick it in there that way.

I mention this because a car needing emergency services on a divided highway
will get them better and faster if the "ELT" on the car is showing which
side of the divided road it might be on. With a 60' uncertainty....no one
knows. A 4-lane road may be only 48' + 2 feet of barrier, 50' wide.

Send the ambulance up the wrong side...and it may be stuck behind traffic,
so someone dies.

That's probably not going to happen with APRS, but that's what the 60'
"increment" can do for you.

More mundanely, it can locate me on either of two streets, more or less, but
it can't show that I'm actually not on either street at all--I'm in an
interior courtyard. Block is about 100' wide, and the Kenwood locations
can't deal with that at all. They only know two spots, both closer to the
edges.

"Ooops."

Need to locate a specific vehicle in a parking lot? 60' can be 8-10 cars
wide and maybe you don't have a good description. "White ford" in a
snowstorm.<G> Again, which one is it? Wouldn't it be easier to support WAAS
GPS and only have to look at 2 of them, with the typical 3-meter accuracy?

60' is probably good enough if you're lobbing 16" shells from the Iowa.
Maybe. But I suspect even their gunners would take pride in doing a better
job than that.<G>

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: APRS Hardware
From: "KC2MMi" <kc2mmi@verizon.net>
Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 09:29:31 -0400
X-Message-Number: 10

Deni, it isn't that easy. There's no all-in-one solution, the closest you
ccan come is to buy a GPS and hook it up to an APRS radio (i.e. Kenwood
D700) and install a good antenna as well.

The Pocketrack "can" replace the radio but it only puts out 250mW, and
unless you add a high gain antenna (think 5-6 feet tall) you may have a
range of less than 1/2 mile in urban areas. Since the base stations are not
that common...no signal goes anywhere useful. Eventually I'll be using a
Pocketrack in a vehicle--first it will need an RF xmit booster and there are
considerations on that as well. (Like, it transmits blind, so running it all
the time would not be appreciated.)

Commercial vehicle tracking systems have their pros and cons, among them
expense. But for a turnkey solution that might be what to look at.
Otherwise, you've got to do so work with pieces, and put some power behind
the transmitter. (And check your area, to see what the coverage is.)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: APRS Hardware
From: David Rush <david@davidarush.com>
Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2004 08:37:56 -0600
X-Message-Number: 11

Deni:

A Kenwood D700 and a GPS receiver (Deluo is inexpensive and works fine, 
new Garmin GPS18 looks promising) is probably the quickest solution.
D700 $550 (?)
GPS $100
Total: $650 plus a bit for cables, etc., call it $700

Perhaps a better set-and-forget (fewer knobs and settings to get mucked 
up, and cheaper) solution might be a TinyTrak3-based system.  Get a 
TinyTrak3, any old mobile 2m rig capable of supporting packet, a GPS, 
cable them up, configure, adjust, and you're done.
TinyTrak3 $35
New 2m rig $170
GPS $100
Total $305 plus cables, etc. call it $400 (or much less with a scrounged 
radio and home-built cables).

You could go with a PocketTracker, which is VERY compact and 
inexpensive, and works great for me around town, but not-so-well out in 
the boonies.  See: http://davidarush.com/hamradio/aprs/pt-vs-mobile.html 
for a comparison I did.

TinyTrak3 and PocketTracker are send-only systems - you won't receive or 
display info from other users.  The D700 will show packets from other users.

Add an antenna to either option.

David, ky7dr

deni wrote:

>Gentlemen,
>I have been told this is the place to get recommendations for hardware.  I
>want something that I can put into my vehicle and then not have to bother
>with it anymore.  If I could get it all in one packet that would be better
>but I do not seem to find anything like that.  The tiny track III looks like
>a good start.  At the moment, I have nothing (mobile that is) and am anxious
>to get reporting my whereabouts while mobile.
>
>Any ideas and suggestions appreciated, either on or off the list.
>Thanks and 73
>Deni
>WB0TAX

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